Path: shell.portal.com!shell.portal.com!not-for-mail From: ! Newsgroups: alt.meditation,alt.yoga,alt.zen,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.philosophy.zen,alt.consciousness,talk.religion.misc,alt.religion.sexuality,alt.magick.tantra,talk.religion.buddhism Subject: Re: Sex and the Dharma Date: 22 Dec 1995 07:29:44 -0800 Organization: Portal Communications (shell) Lines: 19 Sender: tyagi@shell.portal.com Message-ID: <4beit8$qt0@jobe.shell.portal.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: jobe.shell.portal.com Xref: shell.portal.com alt.meditation:17741 alt.yoga:3528 alt.zen:19906 alt.magick.tyagi:5681 alt.philosophy.zen:5176 alt.consciousness:21873 talk.religion.misc:194608 alt.religion.sexuality:9833 alt.magick.tantra:378 talk.religion.buddhism:14318 |The facts should be the true teachers, not the people. but they cannot be, for the transmission is mind to mind, and this does not allow the medium of 'facts' to ascertain its entirety. that is why koans are used, so as to plow the mindfield in preparation a truly marvellous seed of awakening |These Gurus sound like attachments to me. upaya, the sin of practice |Maybe we should just do away with this whole personal teacher thing |and put our trust in the Sangha instead. there is no choice between the two as a buddhist or a Buddhist, one accepts the Buddha, the Dharma and the Sangha as a matter of course, do we not? I had thought this (interpreted in any number of ways) was rather central to the Buddha's teachings (or his honorable successors perhaps) To: alt.zen From: ! (tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com) Subject: Good Buddhism Date: Unknown |...it is more illuminating to examine the concept of "good Buddhist" |What could that mean? a good buddhist is one that cleaves to the Buddha (that is the presence of awakening), the Dharma (teachings which lead to awakening) and the Sangha (others that assist in awakening). once awakening is realized, even these three are released. |how you would answer a novice who asks you, based on your experience, |should they enter the practice? only if you cannot do otherwise or the novice feels it will be of benefit |...an implicit decision on their part that [the adept] would want other |people to undertake the practice. no, practice is delusion |...how can they answer the novice who asks them 'Why should I practice? you should avoid practice. practice is delusion. if you discover that you are already deluded, then practice may be a delusion-tool to help one lose delusion, but practice is delusion also and must eventually be abandoned. to take up practice for no reason is dangerous |What did it do for you after all those years? it does something during the time, not afterwards. discipline helps me learn |You say you 'gained nothing', so why should I bother?' you should not. zen is not about gaining things, but about releasing them |Why wouldn't it say that the teacher's methods got in the way of |their students attainment? all methods get in the way of release |False notions and goals are inevitable when starting practice, it is a given |that students will have them, if they have read even a little of the Zen fairy |tales. The question is, how to clarify them? discuss them, ask the students to explain what they think of them, then ask them to come up with 10 different explanations which are contradictory yet just as convincing |>Why not the individual practitioner choose their own way? this happens regardless |How then can one avoid delusion or makyo? delusion/makyo are not to be avoided. they are to be experienced and deeply, for what they are |...what is the best way to check if we are deluded? we are all deluded. anyone who says differently is deluding themselves Path: shell.portal.com!shell.portal.com!not-for-mail From: ! Newsgroups: alt.meditation,alt.yoga,alt.zen,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.philosophy.zen,alt.consciousness,talk.religion.misc,alt.religion.sexuality,alt.magick.tantra,talk.religion.buddhism Subject: Re: Sex and the Dharma Date: 22 Dec 1995 07:29:44 -0800 Organization: Portal Communications (shell) Lines: 19 Sender: tyagi@shell.portal.com Message-ID: <4beit8$qt0@jobe.shell.portal.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: jobe.shell.portal.com Xref: shell.portal.com alt.meditation:17741 alt.yoga:3528 alt.zen:19906 alt.magick.tyagi:5681 alt.philosophy.zen:5176 alt.consciousness:21873 talk.religion.misc:194608 alt.religion.sexuality:9833 alt.magick.tantra:378 talk.religion.buddhism:14318 |The facts should be the true teachers, not the people. but they cannot be, for the transmission is mind to mind, and this does not allow the medium of 'facts' to ascertain its entirety. that is why koans are used, so as to plow the mindfield in preparation a truly marvellous seed of awakening |These Gurus sound like attachments to me. upaya, the sin of practice |Maybe we should just do away with this whole personal teacher thing |and put our trust in the Sangha instead. there is no choice between the two as a buddhist or a Buddhist, one accepts the Buddha, the Dharma and the Sangha as a matter of course, do we not? I had thought this (interpreted in any number of ways) was rather central to the Buddha's teachings (or his honorable successors perhaps) To: alt.zen From: ! (tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com) Subject: Good Buddhism Date: Unknown |...it is more illuminating to examine the concept of "good Buddhist" |What could that mean? a good buddhist is one that cleaves to the Buddha (that is the presence of awakening), the Dharma (teachings which lead to awakening) and the Sangha (others that assist in awakening). once awakening is realized, even these three are released. |how you would answer a novice who asks you, based on your experience, |should they enter the practice? only if you cannot do otherwise or the novice feels it will be of benefit |...an implicit decision on their part that [the adept] would want other |people to undertake the practice. no, practice is delusion |...how can they answer the novice who asks them 'Why should I practice? you should avoid practice. practice is delusion. if you discover that you are already deluded, then practice may be a delusion-tool to help one lose delusion, but practice is delusion also and must eventually be abandoned. to take up practice for no reason is dangerous |What did it do for you after all those years? it does something during the time, not afterwards. discipline helps me learn |You say you 'gained nothing', so why should I bother?' you should not. zen is not about gaining things, but about releasing them |Why wouldn't it say that the teacher's methods got in the way of |their students attainment? all methods get in the way of release |False notions and goals are inevitable when starting practice, it is a given |that students will have them, if they have read even a little of the Zen fairy |tales. The question is, how to clarify them? discuss them, ask the students to explain what they think of them, then ask them to come up with 10 different explanations which are contradictory yet just as convincing |>Why not the individual practitioner choose their own way? this happens regardless |How then can one avoid delusion or makyo? delusion/makyo are not to be avoided. they are to be experienced and deeply, for what they are |...what is the best way to check if we are deluded? we are all deluded. anyone who says differently is deluding themselves Path: shell.portal.com!shell.portal.com!not-for-mail From: ! Newsgroups: alt.religion.buddhism.tibetan Subject: Re: Live Budhas? Date: 29 Apr 1996 23:20:09 -0700 Organization: Portal Communications (shell) Lines: 12 Sender: tyagi@shell.portal.com Message-ID: <4m4bep$ruu@jobe.shell.portal.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: jobe.shell.portal.com |>which was the last [buddha?] you were, you just posted |>have there been buddha woman? women buddhas, yes, many |> Have any people from all of the school of buddhism reach enlighment? all will reach enlightenment. it is a long involved process, some say, but we shall all perservere together