Path: shell.portal.com!shell.portal.com!not-for-mail From: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nocTifer) Newsgroups: talk.euthanasia,alt.religion,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.pagan,alt.satanism,talk.religion.misc,talk.religion.newage,alt.religion.order,alt.society.anarchy Subject: Org Satanism/Feuding (was Re: Shared Mythos (was Re: ...)) Date: 12 Jun 1996 15:24:27 -0700 Organization: Portal Communications (shell) Lines: 248 Sender: tyagi@shell.portal.com Message-ID: <4png2r$n6q@jobe.shell.portal.com> References: <4naih2$nab@a3bsrv.nai.net> <4nkcho$6t1@insosf1.netins.net> <31MAY199613060988@hdc2> Reply-To: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nocTifer) NNTP-Posting-Host: jobe.shell.portal.com Summary: A Satanic religious document, intended to convert you. :> Xref: shell.portal.com talk.euthanasia:3478 alt.religion:2325 alt.magick.tyagi:8454 alt.pagan:162072 alt.satanism:45022 talk.religion.misc:223800 talk.religion.newage:52504 alt.society.anarchy:38564 kaliyuga 49960612 AA1 (I'd like to look at OrgSatanist struggles as a social scientist, break it down for what it is (which I leave open for the moment), and move on, especially as it serves my comprehension and operation of Satanism.) jk1604@hdc.hha.dk (Hr. Vad) quotes: |THE NINE SATANIC STATEMENTS: Commentary |by Tani Jantsang (PART ONE; in the *second* part ("Comment") she addresses the Statements ;>.) Note the percentage of preliminary and tangental issues Tani (TJ) brings to this document. Note the empassioned tone of its rhetoric. I contend this is a Satanic religious document put forward by an overconfident woman with strong political biases and an uninformed conception of science and the scientific method. Her persuasive technique is powerful enough that it at times carries in robustness something my logic does not support, which is why I dedicate time to respond in full as I have. |TO ALL and especially to COS lest you forget! This is an important identification of the type of text we here find. |...Phil and I posted things about the truth of dark-force. They might |sound like they agree with COS, but they are in fact purely scientific. |That means that COS agrees with science, not the other way around. Note the congregational address ("COS agrees"; "agree with COS") so prevalent within religious groups. And yet we are led to believe that CoSatanists are 'Freethinkers'. |...stand there with targets on to see what the TOS would do. ...they |did it. After being proven to be ABSOLUTE KNOW NOTHINGS with science, TJ appears to have attached her mind to a version of modern materialism (perhaps as represented by the scientific establishment) and, from this standpoint, begun generalizing about who knows what, etc. It is a common herding tactic, and yet she does not explain or demonstrate this to the apparent target of her writ: CoSatanists, which may imply her ignorance. |...[picked] on our metaphors. ...on our grammar. These are reasonable items of demarcation for certain qualities which the religious might wish to point out to their adversaries. Whether it says anything about Satanism is another matter entirely, depending on how much weight one gives to these particulars, the qualities which are said to be valuable, how signs of them manifest and with whom, etc. If you (and the CoS) identify as 'nonreligious', then it stands to reason that you'd have differences about these particulars when the Setians promote their religious ideology in your faces (whether or not this contradicts your own materialist bent -- I don't yet see evidence that you or CoS is anything like "hard-science"). These differences hardly say anything about their truth value, however, and that you and other OrgSatanists don't appear to realize this is a mark against you. [re: how you all behave in this conflict (something indicative of the idiocy of OrgSatanism):] |To the "professorials" out there they say "tish tish, be reasonable, |you agree with her?" Yes, they agreed because what I said was RIGHT. Right about what? And more importantly, if someone else is suddenly ruled 'right' by a great number of people, especially those who are connected with a conflict, does this necessitate that the solitary or small group of Naysayers (a germ of the Satanic Superplague) be silent, over-ruled, 'hung out to dry', and generally made fun of in public or demonstrating their depravity through gestures indicative of our own? Or is 'professorial' part of the New Order of Satanism, (NOSatanists), who first become religious zealots about subjects (like Satanism) with which they have little personal experience? |To the COSser non professorials they say "be reasonable, you and I |are buddies." To other COSsers they say "You are like my kid |brother on the internet." To young people on COS side or on MY side they |say "Listen young man, listen sonny." To the more literate audience you may address these things for what they are: social graces designed to accomodate and persuade for the benefit of the self within a group; CONFORMITY TO POLITE ADDRESS. Now this is of course not a crime, but you must be talking about something more than this, something like INTENT TO SQUIRM AWAY FROM BEING CAUGHT IN A LIE and perhaps LYING IN GENERAL. You are calling them liars based upon your own ideas. And that is how this entire organized Satanism may be dealt with, like two people standing in a public park screaming "Liar!" at one another in a comic rendering like that of the crotchety old or the rebellious youth. WHO GAINS FROM THE RIVALRY? It draws great attention (just as do the Massive differences between the Catholics and Protestants), and yet ultimately it detracts from my enjoyment of time. This I tend to prefer spending quietly, alone, with friends of a nature generally less contesting of their kindred and yet more genuine of displeasure around things important to them (like bickering, dishonesty and violence). |Such see-thru xtoid tactics as if [the actions of manipulation] |is going to make someone DENY THE TRUTH? And all this in the introduction of a document purporting to be an overview of the 9 Satanic Statements. It is small wonder that I rarely read this woman's work. |...know-nothing liars, PHONEYS and The first is at least partly untrue. I have known the people of the Temple of Set to explain as factually as they know how the ways that things work. They have at times demonstrated to me at least a rudi- mentary exposure to complex concepts and certainly to subjects (in the case of Mr. Aquino and his reading lists) widely diverging and relevant to the path they appear to be treading. While I have not known any member of the Temple of Set to be representing themselves as something other than they were (apart from the obvious and delightful difficulty which the credential of 'Dr.' presents in discussions), I have seen them caught up in lies at times, including regarding my person. Slander of a personal sort does appear to come easy to some individuals, though I do not know this to be either pervasive or promoted within their organization, let alone if it was intentional (though it appears difficult to deny and some of my online acquaintances maintain they have had similar experiences). |...they EVEN RESORT to the notion that we are hurting their feelings? |Or get Diane to feel as if we are HURTING them? HURTING THEM? That might have been the only sincere response. |WORDS do not hurt. They can if a person takes those words very seriously, if they come to associate themselves with words, and what is said about one, etc. In such a case then words may be used as powerful emotive spells to very seriously hurt someone should we desire it. The more experience which is shared with the victim the easier it is to hook into their attach- ments and knife them with our words upon that trust we have built. Sometimes these mutual knifings become feuds and warfare and genocide. |...blowing a person's job ... The politics of Satanism. When a 'Satanic' organization begins identifying 'manipulation' as related directly to magick, then it becomes rather difficult to trust in regards its battle tactics. Organizations which do not have stated goals and purposes, etc. appear more dangerous to the individual, as they may not have any qualms about what they do with the data with which we trust them (be this our names, our communication references, or even the fact of our interest), yet the ones which *do* have such things stipulated may be far more insidious and difficult to assess. They may or may not abide by or mean what they say. Only long-term observation (the fundaments of what Ms. Jatsang calls Hard Science) and careful reporting (which I do not see amongst the OrgSatanists as yet) will demonstrate their overall effect they could have on our lives. In some cases it could mean that we shall have to face their illegal activities, or their disrespectful targetting through exposure and what are called 'shady tactics', and yet in a cut-throat world where the sheep get eaten by the Satanists, what can more you really expect? If there is a careful accounting of the allegations which Ms. Jatsang purports against the Aquinos and their Satanic(?) org, then perhaps the matter can be discussed as regards their reputation and tactics. Presently their reputation in the online community is rather divided of review and stinks of tar (a wonderful ascription!). |...NONE of the TOSsers jump on Aquino for doing this that means they |CONDONE IT. Or they don't know about it. I believe Lupo when he says he was put into jeapordy or exposure. It is difficult via this medium to verify beyond this, however, and that may be some reason why the debate continues to occupy OrgSatanists minds (I gift you with a class all your own: bickering, snotty, petty, stubborn and naive.... OS!). |They, like the fundies would, switch to "but it's only the truth" |righteous bullshit. .... Fascinating study of the snake biting its own tail, Captain. Didn't you just see Tani stating flatly that she was 'RIGHT' and 'it is only the TRUTH'? How shall we unravel this conundrum? Perhaps we could set this TAR BABY down on the road in the Bible Belt somewhere and let it amass a Great Force of Satanist Revolutionaries? |NO. Phil and I by FLAMING them on the inet helped to nail them down, |EXPOSE THEM and lure them out to SHOW EVERYONE just what they do and |how they do it. But wait! What if they aren't the only ones doing it?! What if we only see best what lies in others when within our bosom there it lies inspiring our fear and loathing?? |There are some of you out there who agree with the basic FOUNDATION of |the COS because of your own hard-science reality knowledge, knowledge |you can't deny. This is some Scary OS. (OrgShit; OrgSatanism; Operating System) I wonder who will be installing the Program. :> [Tani describes the experience of her fellow Satanists for them:] |Dissociated. |he only time that passes is when the REALITY OF LIFE |is uppermost and you KNOW the "TRUTH" of things. Then you become |LIKE COS people. Like NORMAL ANIMALS. So we begin to hear the two-tier description of TJ at its most basic: COS ("NORMAL ANIMALS") TOS (SPECIAL ANIMALS; to ToS neat-special; to CoS ick-special) rest of the Satanists, I imagine rest of the Herd, I presume (oo my head hurts, if I become one of the normal animals won't I become part of the Herd??? Satan help!) [part two saved for next post :>] tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com nocTifer -------- [This has been a Satanic religious document intended to convert you.] -- Ensure my response - CC public replies to email http://www.hollyfeld.org/~tyagi/nagasiva.html (emailed replies may be posted) check: http://www.paranoia.com/coe/