Path: kudonet.com!kudo20!tyagi From: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nocTifer) Newsgroups: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.satanism,talk.religion.misc Subject: Satanism, Demons, Agape Date: 10 Apr 1997 23:36:25 -0700 Organization: KudoNet On-Line Services Lines: 88 Sender: tyagi@bjt.net Message-ID: Reply-To: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nocTifer) NNTP-Posting-Host: kudo20.kudonet.com Xref: kudonet.com alt.magick.tyagi:8924 alt.magick:80361 alt.satanism:50015 talk.religion.misc:231550 [Orig-To: private email] 49961021 AA1 Hail (heal) Satan! (my adversary -or- wild nature) nocTifer: # >the role of 'shaitan' within Judaism and early Christianity also may # >be applied here -- inasmuchas the 'shaitan' is a temporary adversary, # >someone who tempers us in the cause of the divine, so too do I see # >that some demons/dakini will appear fearsome and antagonistic to me, # >just as some humans will. taking this into account is part of the # >training of the mage, and ceremonial magicians for this reason are # >often instructed in methods of 'banishing' or of 'agape' (resolving # >all apparent dualisms) as preparation for noxious encounters. my Am Her Dic says that 'satan' comes from a word meaning 'adversary', as have most other reputable sources I've looked into, including Elaine Pagels. 'Devil' derives from 'diabolus' or 'diabollein', 'slanderer'/'accuser'. no doubt some jews (early Christians among them) did begin to see 'Satan' as a consistent entity, but I have never before heard from reliable sources that "the Jews" see or saw 'Satan' as some sort of archangel in Hir *origins*. Biblical versions of Satan render Hir as an angelic 'Prosecuting Attorney'. you can find Pagels in the Ref directory at: ftp://ftp.hollyfeld.org/pub/Esoteric/Usenet/Satanism/Ref/satan.epagels in which Pagels claims that "The Bible nowhere explains Satan's origin", and my recent reading of her book indicates that prior to Biblical times the name was instead used as a noun ('a satan'), as I have said otherwise (*an* adversary), though I'd love to be corrected if necessary. re: banishing being "a necessary ability in dealing with spirits" I disagree strongly. my way is that of agape in this matter, so it has kept me from some traditional Western martialities. demonkind are my kin. I seek not to disrespect them. my statement has to do with the Thelemic/Hermetic and ceremonial approach to magick, perhaps polarized into 'thelemic' and 'agapic' design. the thelemic method is through force or will to dominate and protect oneself from the adversary/enemy. I view this as conventional within the ceremonial and often greater religious world, reflected even by Wiccans who use 'Circles of Protection' (derived, at least according to authors like Aidan Kelly, from Hermetic grimoires). the agapic method is to encompass and dwell so within the cosmos as a whole, not just an interior experience, that no enemy exists. the master walks through the carnage untouched. the horrid foe fails to recognize the target. the perfect lover becomes invisible or ceases to be a threat to the attacker. the mage vanishes from the scene. this is perhaps more akin to the taoist (wu-wei) or perhaps sufi (ihsan) magician/master. agape is the force behind the expression of resolution of apparent polarities. this is well-examined within Crowley's works and I have seen few speak even within the Thelemic community concerning the agapic approach, though it be described within such texts as _Moonchild_, especially in relation to a character with which it is said Crowley himself identified -- that of Simon Iff. re: Kali and Her mood #>...fear Her though we might, we are subject to Her mood. my will is Her will, for I follow it whenever I discern it. note that I don't worship Satan for this reason. if it be the will of Kali *and* Satan to rend us all limb from limb, then I'll become their squire, perhaps their knight and champion. I don't see myself taking up arms against humans, however. goes way far against my pacifist manners. blessed beast! nocTifer tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com -- see http://www.hollyfeld.org/~tyagi/nagasiva.html and call: 408/2-666-SLUG!!! ---- (emailed replies may be posted) ---- CC public replies to author ---- * * * Asphalta Cementia Metallica Polymera Coyote La Cucaracha Humana * * *