Path: typhoon.sonic.net!not-for-mail Newsgroups: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.paranormal.spells.hexes.magick,alt.religion.wicca,alt.witchcraft Subject: Stupid Magic vs. Social Phantasms From: nagasiva Reply-To: spam@luckymojo.com User-Agent: nn/6.6.0 Lines: 93 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 20:10:52 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.201.242.18 X-Complaints-To: abuse@sonic.net X-Trace: typhoon.sonic.net 1035663052 208.201.242.18 (Sat, 26 Oct 2002 13:10:52 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 13:10:52 PDT Xref: typhoon.sonic.net alt.magick.tyagi:34954 alt.magick:322448 alt.religion.wicca:607975 alt.witchcraft:49909 50021026 VII om from private email: > ...learning white and black magic, mostly black though. the ways of power have their prices. these are not always either social or penalties per se. > ...i was on your website... and i went to the black magic > section and clicked on the hurtful spells. It said in order > to use a death or hurt spell you must be willing to die or > be hurt. these are spells. not all magic deals with spells. what any web page might have said (there are hundreds of web pages at Lucky Mojo, many of the spell pages edited by sri catyananda, a variety of prerequisites described by contributors/editors). it is not my opinion that using antagonistic magic requires being willing to die or be hurt. this is a fallacy and there are no arguments of which I am aware, outside questionable religious traditions, in which this perforce must be true. > ...i have heard from my uncle and grandma and a few other > people i know, that if you use a spell to hurt someone or > to kill someone, some day that spell will come back to you. > Is this true? this is a FAQ! I'll address it as such and include it in the next revision of nagasiva's alt.magick FAQ at http://www.luckymojo.com/namfaq.html Q: Does bad magic rebound and hurt the caster? while fumbled magical spells, constructed or composed in a manner conducive to misdirecting magical energies and accidentally putting oneself in harm's way are certainly possible, the moral cosmic principle which is presupposed by the typical religious and parental authority describing retributive results from aggression is without basis in any metaphysical sense of which I am aware. the student of non-dualism and the mysteries of the East will quickly recognize that the polar character of positive and negative action bequeaths no particular authority to those obsessed with either pole. in fact, negativity is quite important to discipline and preparations for ritual ('got to break some eggs to make an omelette', etc.). the heavy emphasis on banishing in the ceremonial magic community (a distinctly negative magical rite) and on asceticism amongst mystics point to the benefits of the negative spiritual pole. stupidity aside, the natural rhythms and currents include destruction as well as construction, and the skilled adept will master each. > If i use a spell to hurt someone, will it someday come back > and hurt me? What about a death spell?.... my impression is that the singular death spell will not become autonomous in some peculiar fashion and return to haunt you. I know of no observable cosmic principles which condition the mage toward either supportive or destructive aims. all those influences I have heretofore seen are social and conceptual, designed to fence in the power of the potential renegade or solitary with their own phantasms and what passes for ethics. these phantasms are created by those desperate to control the activities of others, sometimes out of quite compassionate response to horrible tragedies and results they ascribe to a magical spell or ritual without empirical reliability. these ideological restraints are are essentially social enslavement mechanisms (using the old Bogey or Titan-god), and can be found at the heart of many occult secret societies (beware of hamstringing oaths required by these social groups -- know what you are signing up for, as the value of organizations in the attainment of power is over-rated and their requirements are typically far worse for the career of the mage than any results obtained as a solitary working spells in experiment and practical effect or the concentration upon the mysteries directly without intercessors on our behalf). foolishly wasting one's energies on obsessing negativity will lead the mage into a quagmire of personal confusion and a lonely tower of occult hubris. being equipped to prune does not mean the garden can endure endless pruning. it merely indicates a juvenile relation to the art and an imbalance when it comes to destruction. 333