Path: shell.portal.com!shell.portal.com!not-for-mail From: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nagasiva) Newsgroups: alt.religion.buddhism,talk.religion.buddhism,talk.religion.misc,alt.magick.tyagi,talk.religion.newage,alt.philosophy.zen Subject: BHo: Nirvana (Was Re: what's the meaning of nirvana?) Followup-To: alt.religion.buddhism,talk.religion.buddhism,talk.religion.misc,alt.magick.tyagi,talk.religion.newage,alt.philosophy.zen,alt.religion.buddhism.tibetan Date: 15 Feb 1996 16:33:00 -0800 Organization: Portal Communications (shell) Lines: 55 Sender: tyagi@shell.portal.com Message-ID: <4g0jbs$kig@jobe.shell.portal.com> References: <4fra4c$t7j@news-e1a.megaweb.com> <4ftnnh$f29@news1.usa.pipeline.com> Reply-To: wboscoho@usa.pipeline.com (Bosco Ho) NNTP-Posting-Host: jobe.shell.portal.com Xref: shell.portal.com alt.religion.buddhism:204 talk.religion.buddhism:16991 talk.religion.misc:205290 alt.magick.tyagi:6691 talk.religion.newage:48343 alt.philosophy.zen:6300 [from alt.religion.buddhism.tibetan: wboscoho@usa.pipeline.com (Bosco Ho)] On Feb 13, 1996 16:24:09 in article , 'Burglar@gnn.com (Burglar)' wrote: >In article Patrick Walsh >wrote: >>Nirvana is the elimination of all defilements or obstructions to the >>nature of mind. But it is not the final goal. >(delurking...) Pardon my ignorance, but what IS the final goal? > >-Ken/Eleven Shadows from the perspective of the mahayanists, in this case Tibetan Buddhism, there are 2 obstructions. 1) to liberation and 2) to ominscience. Some may use other phases like "relative nirvana" and "absolute nirvana." The 4th arhantship is that of liberation (which corresponds to 8th ground (a la Arya Nagarjuna,) or maybe 7th to some.) Buddhahood is the 10th ground. May it helps to clarify some of the terms here. According to Abhidharma, from the perspective of the non-mahayanist tradition, there are 4 levels of arhantship. And the 4th level cannot be destroyed by earth, fire or deluge. The 10 grounds is also the 10 blumis as elaborated by the Yogacara doctrine. YITD BH -- Namo Buddhaya Namo Dharmaya Namo Sanghaya from the perspective of the mahayanists, in this case Tibetan Buddhism, there are 2 obstructions. 1) to liberation and 2) to ominscience. Some may use other phases like "relative nirvana" and "absolute nirvana." The 4th arhantship is that of liberation (which corresponds to 8th ground (a la Arya Nagarjuna,) or maybe 7th to some.) Buddhahood is the 10th ground. May it helps to clarify some of the terms here. According to Abhidharma, from the perspective of the non-mahayanist tradition, there are 4 levels of arhantship. And the 4th level cannot be destroyed by earth, fire or deluge. The 10 grounds is also the 10 blumis as elaborated by the Yogacara doctrine. YITD BH -- Namo Buddhaya Namo Dharmaya Namo Sanghaya -- To ensure my response CC all public replies to email (READ alt.magick.tyagi) (emailed replies may be posted) * http://www.hollyfeld.org/~tyagi/nagasiva.html INTENTIONAL .SIG PROTEST: FUCK SHIT PISS COCKSUCKER MOTHERFUCKER TITS CUNT