Path: typhoon.sonic.net!triton.skycache.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!news1.bellglobal.com!news20.bellglobal.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <38D8654B.3EAB30EF@sympatico.ca> From: richard sprigg Reply-To: kteis@sympatico.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [en]C-SYMPA (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.lucky.w,alt.magick,alt.christnet.demonology Subject: Re: Demon Protection (was Demon appearance) References: <8ac44u$b9a$1@slb6.atl.mindspring.net> <38CC23B1.C9048506@watch.com> <38CC24B6.C7F09E03@watch.com> <38cc392b.5605808@news> <8avbpu$406@bolt.sonic.net> <8b2nsg$i79$1@nnrp1.deja.com> <3_6B4.143$U93.8454@sapphire.mtt.net> <8b32fb$p3t$1@nnrp1.deja.com> <8b3dg4$p8$1@nnrp1.deja.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 80 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 06:06:40 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.172.251.103 X-Trace: news20.bellglobal.com 953705200 206.172.251.103 (Wed, 22 Mar 2000 01:06:40 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 01:06:40 EST Organization: Sympatico Xref: typhoon.sonic.net alt.magick.tyagi:22225 alt.lucky.w:7103 alt.magick:184449 alt.christnet.demonology:10370 aka_praxis@my-deja.com wrote: > In the bible, even as it is today there are references to it. The > Angels known as the watchers were thrown out of heaven for mating with > humans. This is apocrypha from the first century bc, and not part of the christian book, which is an assembly of suitably "massaged" parts of the pentateuch, septuagint and the writings assembled by the church fathers between 75 and 150 e.v. > This was not Lucifer and his troops but a second fall of angels > for a different reason. Indeed. There must, judging from the various apocrypha , to have been a veritable hailstorm of descending angels, with various leaders. > In one of the early eucomenical congresss (5th > century I think) certain books that were considered inspired by god up > until that time were removed from the bible as a result of a > philosophical schism among the early church fathers. Not so. The Apocrypha (not considered part of the holy texts by the Hebrews, neither then nor now) were included in the Vulgate edition, with secondary status, in the 4th century. At the council of Trent, the church tossed out Esdras I and II and the prayer of Manasses. They retained: Tobit, Judith, The other half of Esthser, the Wisdom of Solomon, Ecclesiasticus, Baruch, the Letter of Jeremiah, the additions to Daniel and I and II Maccabees. They remain there to this day. > The argument was > about the separation of the material world or flesh and the spirit. The > view which prevailed was that they were separate and did not interact > directly. Thus the book of Enoch, the most important prophet in what > became the old testament was removed and all the others were edited to > remove most obvious references on the subject. Enoch was never a part of the source books for the old testament, and was never a part of the Bible. It is simple apocrypha from the first century, no more important that, say, "Vitae adae et evae". It is fascinating as a record of the time that Judaism was flirting with the concept of dualism, but it really isn't that important. > Still the book of Enoch > is so important that other major figures in the old testament quote > from it and Enoch is mentioned throughout it. This is total balls. Enoch is just not very old in context. The hellenized Septuagint that was the source for much of the old testament is significantly older, and that is a greek translation. > > > Like I said, though, some passages survived the church father's editing > job. The one where "..and they saw the daughters of man and found them > fair and took from them wives all of whom they found fair,... and there > were giants in those days, men of renown" is a hold over. Or plagiarism on the part of the author of Enoch. The fate of individuals attempting to promulgate new ideas was uncertain, and thus they often used the names of old prophets. > Well the book > of Enoch was more detailed and obviously here was a major prophet > saying angels had mated and produced childrem with humans blatantly > contradicting the prevailing church father's dogma, -so inspired by god > or not it had to go. The whole of the apocrophia is a fascinating read. Some of it. The story of Azazel or Satanail is interesting, but other passages would put a cokehead to sleep.