Newsgroups: alt.pagan,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.religion.wicca,talk.religion.misc,alt.satanism Path: shell.portal.com!svc.portal.com!sdd.hp.com!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!kfilan From: kfilan@netcom.com (kevin filan) Subject: Re: Satanism and Huson Message-ID: Followup-To: alt.pagan,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.religion.wicca,talk.religion.misc,alt.satanism Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest) X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1] References: <490bf8$45c@jobe.shell.portal.com> Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 00:02:27 GMT Lines: 65 Sender: kfilan@netcom19.netcom.com Xref: shell.portal.com alt.pagan:135287 alt.magick.tyagi:5141 alt.magick:60165 alt.religion.wicca:17591 talk.religion.misc:190316 alt.satanism:28960 mark (whitroth@gagme.wwa.com) wrote: : *sigh* : Are we back to this a*gain*? I know... I usually make it a point never to respond to a post which is x-posted to alt.pagan and alt.satanism, but just this once I'll make an exception. : > #|>:to side-swipe its bogey through launching a counter-propaganda : > #|>:indicating that Christianity *spawned* Satanism (which it did not), : It did not? Um, kindly explain this, while referencing the following : items: : 1) the "Black Mass" Certainly based on a Christian ritual (the Roman Catholic Mass). Which particular "Black Mass" are you talking about? Do you mean the "Mass of St. Secaire" which was intended to cause the death of an enemy? Do you mean the "Black Mass" of La Voisin, performed to win the heart of King Louis for Madame de Montespan? Do you mean the masses of Vintras (considered "Satanic" by Eliphas Levi, at least...), or any Mass performed by a defrocked Priest or by someone who doesn't have the authority to do so? Or do you mean something else entirely? : 2) Gilles de Rais Appears to have committed numerous atrocities in an attempt to gain the "Philosopher's Stone." Seems to have been an aspiring alchemist... and not a particularly successful one, so far as we can tell. : 3) the Hellfire Club A bunch of guys who got drunk and held orgies while worshipping various Greek gods. Similar to most of today's Pagan community, although probably more fun to party with. Can you explain how (2) and (3) are particularly influenced by Christianity? : As I've said before, I'll defend other neoPagans, but I stop short at : Satanists. I will leave to y'all the task of explaining to clueless : turkeys, who do not understand why a circular argument is invalid, how : Satanism isn't the Satanism they think it is, it's a different Satanism. : To me, that's on par with that academic in the early part of this century : who proved, at least to his own satisfaction (and I'm not making this up, : mind you, you can go look it up), that the Odessey and the Iliad were : not written by the blind poet named Homer, but by a different blind poet : named Homer. : mark "avoiding Sisyphusian tasks is my hobby", the Silverdragon I seriously doubt that any ancient Greek would recognize a modern ritual to Diana as being anything like what he practiced. I also doubt that our modern conception of "The Goddess" resembles the ancient one in any particular way. Does this mean that you have no right to call yourself "Pagan" but should instead find another word? (Like "Wiccan," say, or "New Age Type Person") Peace Kevin Filan -- ________________________________________________________________ * Come on Lucifer, do your duty Kevin Filan * Bang my head, shake your booty Rakshasa PODSnet, FidoNet, IRC * Wham, bam, thank you Nell kfilan@netcom.com * I'm on the Amtrak to Hell * -- Berke Breathed _______________________________________________________________