From thelema93-l-owner@www.hollyfeld.org Mon Dec 6 12:10:50 1999 Return-Path: thelema93-l-owner@www.hollyfeld.org Received: from www.hollyfeld.org (h004033a6307e.ne.mediaone.net [24.218.42.227]) by prop.sonic.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA07734 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 12:10:48 -0800 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by www.hollyfeld.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA27082 for thelema93-l-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 16:21:44 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: www.hollyfeld.org: majordom set sender to owner-thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org using -f Received: (from kender@localhost) by www.hollyfeld.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA27074 for thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 16:21:42 -0500 Received: from marine.sonic.net (marine.sonic.net [208.201.224.37]) by www.hollyfeld.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA26973 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 16:19:34 -0500 Received: (qmail 24258 invoked from network); 6 Dec 1999 20:06:30 -0000 Received: from prop.sonic.net (208.201.224.193) by marine.sonic.net with SMTP; 6 Dec 1999 20:06:30 -0000 Received: from bolt.sonic.net (yronwode@bolt [208.201.224.36]) by prop.sonic.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA07157 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 12:07:32 -0800 X-envelope-info: Received: (from yronwode@localhost) by bolt.sonic.net (8.8.8/8.7.3) id MAA09384 for thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 12:06:30 -0800 Message-Id: <199912062006.MAA09384@bolt.sonic.net> Subject: LaVey, Thelema and Crowley (was True Identity of Thelemites) To: thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 12:06:30 -0800 (PST) From: "nagasiva@luckymojo.com" In-Reply-To: <19991205015532.72072.qmail@hotmail.com> from Frater 365 at "Dec 5, 99 01:55:32 am" From: nagasiva@luckymojo.com (nigris (333)) Orientation: Arkaotika, Ville of the Forest, Kali Fornika, US -- Kali Yuga Organization: http://www.satanservice.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org Status: RO 49991206 IVom "Frater 365" : # It is a well known fact that LaVey was also a member of a # Thelemic Order, as stated in his biography. eh? you mean: As early as 1951, Anton's attitudes had been formulated enough to try to seek out a group of "official" devil worshippers. He visited a chapter of the Order of Thelema in Berkeley; followers of Aleister Crowley, who prided himself on being "The Wickedest Man in the World" and supposedly in touch with the darker elements. Anton was disappointed to find the Berkeley bunch mystically- minded card readers who emphasized the study of Eastern philosophy, Oriental languages, stars and contemplation to reach the spiritual Nirvana of Oneness. A few years earlier, Anton had ordered Crowley's books from Jack Parsons in Pasadena -- *Equinox of the Gods*, *Magic [sic] Without Tears*, *Moonchild*, *Diary of a Dope Fiend*, *Sword and Song*, *Tannhaeuser*, *The Book of Lies*, *Yoga For Yahoos*, and *The Book of the Law*. When John Symonds' biography of Crowley, *The Great Beast*, came out in 1952, Anton concluded that the Thelemites founder was a druggy poseur whose greatest achievements were as a poet and mountain climber. Despite hysterical tales of the wild Satanic orgies he was said to preside over and the blasphemous insights his writings were said to contain, Crowley's followers were rather innocuous -- much more ethereal than Anton expected. It occurred to kAnton that people seemed compelled to manufacture fantasies about supposed Devil-worshipping cults, no matter how bland the group might actually be. _____________________________________________________ "The Secret Life of a Satanist", by Blanche Barton, Feral House, 1992; p. 61. ----------------------------------- it doesn't look from this like he was ever a 'member'. to what 'facts' are you referring, exactly? to which biography? # This is where he learned much of his magick. where did you get this notion? # It seems that Thelema was not rebellious enough for him, that seems evident from the foregoing, yes. # or he needed to feed his ego and hack from Crowley's writings. to which of Crowley's writings are you referring, exactly? I gathered he "hacked" from Redbeard, and there are rumours that he stole from Rand's "Atlas Shrugged", but I've yet to look at the evidence presented to verify it. seldom have I heard that he stole from Crowley. his 'Law of the Forbidden' does have a certain Hermetic ring to it which may be quite reminiscent of the 'Law of Thelema', but there are so many different interpretations of these things that I cannot call this a 'theft from Crowley'. feeding the ego seemed a preference of *both* of these men, especially as the former ingested a fair amount of psycho- actives which obviously inflamed his ego and caused him no end of personal problems. the latter may be hoist upon his own pitard should the various details of his self-descript be shown to have been largely fabricated (there are a few web-sites which do this en par with how other cultists like Rajneesh and Hubbard have been discredited thoroughly in the public eye except to the devoted; it should also be done with Crowley, perhaps by devoted Thelemites). blessed beast! ______________________________________________________________________ (333) nagasiva@luckymojo.com; http://www.luckymojo.com/nagasiva.html I don't read everything here; cc me if you absolutely want a response. ____________...oooOOO---thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org---OOOooo..._____________ To unsubscribe send "unsubscribe" to thelema93-l-request@hollyfeld.org To unsubscribe your@email.com send "unsubscribe your@email.com" To unsubscribe from the digest send to thelema93-l-digest-request@hollyfeld.org http://www.hollyfeld.org/heaven/elists/thelema93-l.phtml