Path: shell.portal.com!shell.portal.com!not-for-mail From: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (xiwangmu) Newsgroups: alt.philosophy.taoism,alt.magick.tyagi,talk.religion.newage,talk.religion.misc,alt.consciousness Subject: taoism and reality (was Re: to be a real taoist you must...) Date: 15 Jul 1996 13:03:29 -0700 Organization: Portal Communications (shell) Lines: 85 Sender: tyagi@shell.portal.com Message-ID: <4se86h$a2j@jobe.shell.portal.com> References: <4s5srf$r30@newsbf02.news.aol.com> Reply-To: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (xiwangmu) NNTP-Posting-Host: jobe.shell.portal.com Xref: shell.portal.com alt.philosophy.taoism:4703 alt.magick.tyagi:9408 talk.religion.newage:54431 talk.religion.misc:229429 alt.consciousness:28544 49960715 AA1 Happy NULatix!! Gr8tao : |>|>Strike out the alchemy but keep the rest. key@netcom.com (peter li'ir key): |>|why not alchemy?< Gr8tao : |>The main focus of alchemy was to find the "elixer of Immortality" key@netcom.com (peter li'ir key): |the notion that herbology (chinese medicine) and taoist alchemy |can be separated easily is specious. those who disrespect the complex and arcane will throw out that which we do not understand and call it 'deadly' and 'not worth our time'. this is the value of eclecticism and an honoring of tradition |>|why just the tao?< |>I start with focus on Tao and let that focus be drawn how it will ... that is the only way to focus upon, the only taoism there is |what is taoism? that varies with the geographical region. in China it appears to center on mountain hermits and, within urban centers, upon writings attributed to someone called 'Lao Tzu' or 'Old Boy'. this we can of course not substantiate, but the story of Lao Tzu and the text attributed to him is important to the religious and mystical traditions there are others, such as Wang Ch'ung, Huai-nun Tzu, Lieh Tzu and of course the Mo Tzu to Lao Tzu's Kung Fu Tzu: Chuang Tzu. some of course accept other origins of taoism, such as the legendary magician and reputed alchemist, Chang Tao-ling of the Yellow Hats, and this results in a magico-religious complex within China too. but taoism is not restricted to China except by the over-cautious and small-minded. those who focus upon tao for their source and guide and thereafter take up a movement into the Way are also taoists, whether they care to acknowledge this through sinological naming or no |>|why is ancient important?< |>wisdom and experience is part of ancient teachings. It is not necessary |>for people to forever reinvent the wheel. |wisdom is wisdom. why does it matter if it is reinvented? it does not, except to hermeneuts and fundamentalists |but why ancient lineage? "ancient lineage" is seldom borne out. it is used within most religious tradition so as to constrain language and control through oppressive political maneuvers. constantly, constantly, new things are being called "ancient" according to the desires of the religious, all the while under the blankets the history and in many cases teachings are revised for sincere and sometimes coercive intents |>|>... hold taoism as sacred |>|Why???? |>|why not?< why - to hold *taoism* as sacred is to constrain its spontaneity to a mere shadow of itself, like surrounding a marsh with a concrete barrier. why not - to not hold *taoism* as sacred is to free us to begin to see the tao and experience the sacred way of nature tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com mu -- Ensure my response - CC public replies to email http://www.hollyfeld.org/~tyagi/nagasiva.html (emailed replies may be posted) check: http://www.paranoia.com/coe/