Path: Supernews70!Supernews69!not-for-mail From: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nagasiva) Newsgroups: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.magick.order,alt.thelema,talk.religion.misc,talk.religion.newage Subject: FrAnastasios: Crowley and Thelema Date: 12 Jan 1998 13:10:03 -0800 Organization: Access Internet Communications, Inc. Lines: 55 Message-ID: <69e0rb$mvl$1@shell.accesscom.com> Reply-To: anastasios@earthlink.net NNTP-Posting-Host: 12432@205.226.156.10 X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 (NOV) Xref: Supernews70 alt.magick.tyagi:14680 alt.magick:122536 alt.magick.order:1029 talk.religion.misc:341616 talk.religion.newage:91949 [from thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org: Fr Anastasios ] Renee Rosen wrote: > I don't have time now to reply to the posts that are in reply to my post, > but I just wanted to make one short comment. It seems to me that both I > and the people I've been debating are arguint at cross-purposes, so to > speak. I'm debating what I feel to be *Crowley's* attitude towards women > and his concept of the feminine. Others seem to be defending *Thelemites'* > attitude toward women and concept of the feminine. It's understandable > that when we are debating different things, we will not agree. I agree. > FWIW, I do not believe that Crowley's attitudes and beliefs are > necessarily the ones that should be held by all Thelemites or that they > *should* be held by most Thelemites. In fact, in general, I would say they > are not held by the majority of Thelemites I've interacted with. OTOH, > Crowley's attitudes and beliefs are part of what influenced Thelema and I > sometimes see remnants of these ideas, even in those who would claim that > they do not hold to his ideas at all. No argument here. > I hope this makes my posts on the subject clearer and explains where I'm > coming from. Yep. However. My point(s) was/were, that just because Crowley founded Thelema (and for all intents and puroses, the OTO as it now exists) is no reason to assume that his take is our take. I have always been a member in good standing of the Crowley Reputation Apologists Party, and still say "The man was an ass, the Magician was a Saint." It is pointless to argue endlessly about what a dead man might have thought. He wrote many contradictory things. Take what you like and leave the rest. It's not as though his brilliance is invalidated by having had some idiotic ideas about sexuality. Thelema is not a Crowley personality cult. Neither is the OTO, even if it's obvious that some people think it should be, or are afraid that it is. Your Thelema is what *you* make it. Thy Will be done. 93, 93/93 Fr.'.Anastasios ____________...oooOOO---thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org---OOOooo..._____________ To subscribe send: 'subscribe thelema93-l' to majordomo@hollyfeld.org To unsubscribe send: 'unsubscribe thelema93-l' to majordomo@hollyfeld.org http://www.hollyfeld.org/heaven/elists/thelema93-l.phtml -- (emailed replies may be posted); http://www.hollyfeld.org/~tyagi; 408/2-666-SLUG join the esoteric syncretism in alt.magick.tyagi; http://www.abyss.com/tokus