Path: typhoon.sonic.net!feed.news.sonic.net!sjc70.webusenet.com!c03.atl99!news.webusenet.com!news02.tsnz.net!newsfeed01.tsnz.net!ken-transit.news.telstra.net!news.telstra.net!newsfeeds.bigpond.com!not-for-mail From: "Pat Zalewski" Newsgroups: alt.magick References: Subject: Re: Regardie and the 7=4 Lines: 74 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2003 19:41:37 +1000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 144.134.73.236 X-Trace: newsfeeds.bigpond.com 1057483295 144.134.73.236 (Sun, 06 Jul 2003 19:21:35 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2003 19:21:35 EST Organization: Telstra BigPond Internet Services (http://www.bigpond.com) Xref: typhoon.sonic.net alt.magick:351137 Hi Bob How are things these days? Essentially what you have to say is correct. Evey temple can grant their own grades and I have said that from day 1 and have no argument with that. It is when people state things that are not factual that I sometimes give my two cents worth. There are stacks of people claiming 7=4 these days and to that say good luck to them! A little honesty sometimes goes a long way and people should state that they have formed their own links. Usually though it is through mysterious initiators who cannot be traced. If people want to go down that road then I become very cynical and it simply means they will not stand on their own two feet and take responsibility for their actions. The published rituals 7=4 rituals of the SM had some blinds written into them so I would not care who claimed what. To date I have had four rituals of the 6=5 sent to me and two of the 7=4 that are copies from my original published works. These they swore by all that is holy were given to them by mysterious adepts of an old order. I never puiblished the grips and signs of these rituals either. All were fakes and rehashes of my publications. These days I do not really care that much what is claimed at it matters little to me personally. You mention Chis Hyatt (aka Alan Miller) as Regardies natural successor. Miller might have convinced you of that but not me. Regardie could not care less, and I know that because I asked once over dinner and that is the answer he gave. He said `let them fight it out as I will be out of the picture.' Patrica will verify that. By Regardies successor I persume you mean through Regardie lineage? I really do think it that important any more. You carve your own niche out in the Golden Dawn and usually history will dictate who was what. Well it was nice chatting to you Bob as I just dropped into this news group after many years away from it and it will be many years agai before I pop into it. Pat Zalewski "Sar Draconis" wrote in message news:b97518ae.0307041347.430497b5@posting.google.com... > Back in 1992 the Israel Regardie Foundation furnished me a copy of the > 7=4 manuscript sent by Pat Z. to Israel Regardie. (This is the > typewritten one that at the top, says "Mythical Grade of 7=4", with > the "TH" in "mythical" crossed out and "st" penned in to make it > instead "mystical.") > > Obviously Pat sent Francis this document prior to his death, but also, > according to Pat, he gave Francis the 7=4 AFTER his death as kind of > an honor for all he did for the Golden Dawn. Therefore, according to > Pat, the Israel Regardie Foundation didn't get their 7=4 from him. > Fair enough. > > But if I put in my two cents worth, Francis already had the RITUAL, > and designated Chris Hyatt his successor, (or, at least, in the ISRAEL > REGARDIE FOUNDATION), so whether or not they actually had the 7=4 > authority from Francis to Chris, comes down to some kind of > theological dispute. Its another case of six of one and half a dozen > of the other. > > I can kind of see why one side doesn't want to credit the other side, > but it really doesn't matter to me since both sides are doing the work > anyway. That's why I think the 7=4's who got it from Chris Hyatt are > just as good as the 7=4's who got it from somewhere else. Its all the > same RITUAL in any case. > > SAR